‘Why all the fuss?!’ A shotgun shooter comments on upcoming bans

15 March 2016 – A commenter on UK Shooting News, who describes himself as an “SGC weekender”, has posted an interesting perspective on proposed restrictions on firearms ownership and use.

Posting as “Iain”, he appears to hold a shotgun certificate. His comment opens up a new perspective over much of the fashionable calls for “unity” from certain areas of the target shooting sports.

UK Shooting News attempted to contact “Iain” via the email address he used when posting his comment, asking him whether he’d like to clarify or expand on anything he wrote, but he did not reply.

What follows is his original comment, as posted here on the blog. Iain was commenting on the British police’s proposed gun ban shopping list, parts of which seem to be creeping into the EU gun ban plan.

I only have a SGC, not a FAC, so maybe much of this doesn’t apply to me anyways, and much of it I don’t even understand the references/terminology.

However, from the point of view of a SGC weekender…

My first shotgun was a Winchester SX3 semi-auto, bought cos I loved the non-recoil aspect (ie all the power is used to cycle the next cartridge!). However, 1+2 is plenty, and indeed I only ever shoot 2 anyways, as NO-ONE wants be shooting 3 when they’re only expecting 2… from a one-rule-for-all safety aspect! Looking on the interweb, I can see that I could extend the magazine from 2 to up to 7 (and even more!), but that would invalidate my SGC, and would only really be needed by an American duck shooter who couldn’t hit a barn door at 10 paces!!!

Banning more than 3 shots in a semi-auto??? No probs for me!!! I would only need the +7 extension for shooting ZOMBIES, so I’m not too worried just yet… maybe once TRUMP is in?!

Banning semi-autos altogether? Seems a tad arbitrary, and whilst I now tend to use my o/u shotguns more than the s/a, I know lots of others who prefer their s/a (else ONLY have a s/a), so banning them altogether would be a bit extreme!!!

Banning .50 cal rifles??? Forgive my ignorance, but what the hell do you need a .50 cal for, shooting elephants or rhinos??? Not seen many of those in the UK hills recently… I guess someone, somewhere obvious has one, and has a use for it, but I can’t imagine what… so banning them? No probs…

Air Guns… personally, I have been shot in the head and ankle by Wayne Kerrs with them, so I have no issue with them being licenced on a scaled-down version of a SGC, just as SGC is scaled-down from FAC. A Wayne Kerr with an air gun/rifle can easily maim or kill, so why SHOULDN’T they be licenced?!?!

Mandatory training and testing??? Sounds entirely sensible to me. Wouldn’t have any objection to that!

Entry without warrant??? If the POLICE have reason to believe I have done something stupid, or have threatened someone with the use of my shotgun, then I would entirely expect them to break the door down and take my guns. As a general inspection, I would expect them to just knock, and ask to see my guns, storage, locks, etc – I would NOT expect them to need to make an appointment. As such, my guns are ALWAYS locked away, except when being cleaned, or en route to/from a shoot. If YOU play by the rules, why ould YOU be afraid of PLOD turning up unannounced???

Licensing shotgun cartridges… I always have my SGC with me when I go to a gun shop, so having to show it to purchase them wouldn’t be an issue. WHO has a problem with that???

Abolishing Court Appeals – okay, that’s where they’re overstepping the mark… THAT I do not agree with!!!

But that’s the only thing here that sticks out to me. The rest is just noise. Tidying up some of the licensing? No big deal.

Why all the fuss?!?!?!?!

It seems advocates of “unity” who believe that all shooters are on the same page as themselves have a lot of legwork to do to convince shotgun shooters such as “Iain”, of which UKSN suspects there are quite a lot, that it is in their own interests to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with the practical target shooting disciplines and reject proposed bans and restrictions.

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18 thoughts on “‘Why all the fuss?!’ A shotgun shooter comments on upcoming bans

  1. Nick B

    I think some of the other comments to Iain’s post exemplify why we’re all divided – Iain posted his views which whether we agree with or not – would have been better replied to constructively. Now he’s been pounced on what incentive does he have to educate himself (or be educated by others) and will perhaps rightly go on to think that the “other” shoot disciplines / pastimes are pursued by “types” he doesn’t like.

    A better response would have been to address each of his points in turn eloquently to try and get him onside. That ship has I fear sailed……

    Imagine a none shooter getting the kind of response that Iain did?

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  2. Robert Sandison

    Sounds like he is one of those ”im all right jack” shooters .Unless it adversely effects them directly they don’t care .

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  3. Colin jenkins

    Iain went to a lot
    Of effort to state his views, as already sa D, an opportunity lost to educate him on the wider shooting disciplines – it’s no surprise that 99% of the public and probably 90% of SGC Holders don’t know about practical shooting disciplines and other forms of target shooting when they are deliberately kept hidden to avoid controversy or upsetting the natives.

    Until we are prepared to positively promote and educate fellow shooters and the public about the more dynamic shooting sports that are still taking place in the UK, we will continue to have a fight on our hands to hang on to them – we must Not be scared of the debate or negativity it may bring but use it as an opportunity to come out from hiding into the light.

    Practical shooting is safe (the safest form of shooting with th 1-2-1 RO’ing), disciplined and fun, I personally welcome
    Opportunities such as Iain presented to explain practical shooting – our enthusiasm and passion for the more dynamic styles of shooting is obvious for all to see and if properly explained more often than not people are coming netted, or at least understanding that it’s not dangerous and certsa not nothing to do with “tactical” training

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  4. commonly called cosmin

    I was the ones to answer to Ian in a rude manner I would say. I apologize, but I am tired to see people shooting the more traditional disciplines always seem to not have a clue that there are other types of shooting disciplines. A lot of the points that Ian referred to was about him not being affected by the semi auto ban. Unfortunately I am not in the same boat as Ian and I will be affected if this ban does pass, since I have several guns which “look military”. Alongside me there are approximately 400,000 guns deacts and semi auto 22LR rifles/12guage semi auto shotguns which will be affected. I don’t think from Ian’s point of view this is a trivial matter, I think it is a very serious one

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  5. Giles

    Ian misses the point.. Once the anti’s have eliminated semi automatics which he doesn’t use, they will go after bolt action rifles, which he doesn’t use, and after that black powder firearms, which he doesn’t use.

    After they have banned all other firearms they will go after his beloved shotgun, and there will be no-one left to fight his corner.

    United we stand, and the anti’s know that, so they will disarm us one discipline at a time.

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  6. Tony B

    I think this is so funny and really shows just how one sighted people are in the UK. Sure, fair enough the proposed EU ban could be perceived to be a ban on “specific” firearms but its my believe this can no longer be argued for the UK. In my eyes what the UK Govt is now attempting to do is ban shooting sports all together. While you may allow yourselves to get caught up on the specifics of banning 50 cals, .22 semi autos and military looking firearms its my believe that what their actually doing is banning the individual sports and not specific firearms. This isnt the first step in their plan and I’m sure it wont be their last. Its taken them 20 years since Dunblane to get where they are now and now their using the terrorists attacks and the proposed EU ban to further their cause. Sure it may take another 10 years before they start getting close to banning SGC holders, or then again maybe sooner. I think your very niave if you think the Govt will stop at 50cals etc and really this is just another step to pretty much banning any form of shooting sports in the UK. Certainly banning section 1 shotguns will just about kill the sport of practical shooting. Military looking rifles will seriously damage the sport of gallery shooting. And with the demise of .22 semi auto’s you could certainly wave good bye to mini rifle competitions. As for the 50cal, well this is just the starting point to ban long range shooting. It may well be 50cal this year but you can bet your bottom dollar they will use the same arguments to ban .338 next year and 300wm the year after. And where will it end?! Well quite simply when Iain gets his notification that weekend shotgun shoots are no longer a justifiable reason to have a SGC. Maybe you think I’m being a bit over reactive and that’s fine we’re all entitled to our own opinion. But I for one do not really understand why SGC owners feel themselves immune from future regulations and bans. I mean surely a shotgun is one of the most lethal weapons available and one which is most commonly adopted by villains. I mean just look at the ammunition. What other ammunition can be so easily converted? Sure you can buy birdshot for your clay shooting and all but if YouTube is to believed you can turn that birdshot into just about anything with minimal tools and little effort. Shotguns after all are basically smooth bore cannons so I for one can see a justifiable reason to ban them and to put Iain’s own spin on it

    “Banning shotguns ??? Forgive my ignorance, but what the hell do you need a shotgun for, shooting bright orange pieces of clay? Dont see the point in that… so banning them? No probs… ,”

    Fact is, in UK shooting sports there’s a great deal of snobbery and looking down on other shooters and their chosen disciplines. Personally I don’t get Bench rest….what’s the point of that?! You get a rifle and strap it down to the bench… Do me favour where’s the skill in that so back to Iain’s reckoning “….so banning them? No probs… ,” But whilst I might not get it I accept it as a shooting sport and I can appreciate why people do it and what they get out of it. Its like the difference between football and rugby. At the moment its my believe the Govt is trying to ban football and I’m fairly sure their next step will be to ban rugby and then who knows, maybe tennis! And where will end?! well as the sign states in my local park playground….“no ball games allowed”

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  7. Iain

    Hey, this is IAIN!!!

    To start with “UK Shooting News” own comment that “UK Shooting News attempted to contact “Iain” via the email address he used when posting his comment, asking him whether he’d like to clarify or expand on anything he wrote, but he did not reply.” I can confirm that NO SUCH EMAIL was ever received!!! I have my own mail/web server, so have double-checked that too. So, the so-called request for reply is BOGUS!!!

    Separately, my original post was “jumped on”, despite me clearly stating that I was ONLY commenting on things that I knew of and/or related to me, especially with regards to SGC.

    For some reason, others (the majority?!) on here seem to think that’s it’s right and proper to support things, even if you don’t know nor understand them. If that’s YOUR way of using YOUR brain, go for it, but it’s not MINE!!!

    Furthermore, for UK Shooting News to then break out MY comment into a separate POSTING for trolling / bullying / abuse purposes is simply staggering!!!! So anyone who doesn’t “tow the line” 100% and agree 100% with everything that’s posted gets treated like that, do they??? No-one is allowed to have an educated opinion?

    For the record, I am 51, male, a “professional” (some of you will obviously need to look that up!) and university educated, so those of you referring to me requiring “educating” may need to look first at yourselves!

    As for this thread, Gaz Corfield should be ashamed of himself for trolling/bullying in such a blatant manner. Don’t know what kind of media background you have, but you’ve clearly lost all respectability and credibility!

    PS try emailing me this time, if you want a PERSONAL reply!!!

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    1. Nick B

      Calm down – no need for so much caps lock!

      The educate comments from me specifically was me responding to your statements along the lines of not see why anyone would need either a S1 shotgun or a .50 (I presumed BMG – ergo, I hopefully educated as to a few possible reasons.

      Equally you can’t seriously act offended at the education comments (it seriously wasn’t meant as an insult) and then come back with this “think that’s it’s right and proper to support things, even if you don’t know nor understand them” by your own admission you don’t know or understand – so how does one come to know and understand? education.

      To be honest – I can’t split the difference between yourself and any generic anti opposed to all forms of shooting, how sad that is when all shooting sports are under threat we can’t stand together.

      Nick

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  8. Colin Jenkins

    Iain

    Are you at all interested in finding out about those shooting sports that you currently don’t understand or care about whether or not they are banned?

    If the tables were turned and there was an outcry and call for a ban on O/U and SS shotguns after (say) the Cumbrian shooting spree with a shotgun, would you be upset if the Target shooting community said “no big deal I don’t see the need for a shotgun so ban away” instead of calling for a bit of solidarity and common sense to prevail?

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    1. Iain

      Colin,

      As per my original comment, I only referred to the points that I knew/understood. “No big deal” related to those points only, as per my specific comments. In my mind, to blindly back/support something you do not know/understand is no better than those seemingly attacking your hobby/sport/occupation. Alas, judging from the trolling on this forum, that’s clearly what I am supposed to do, and anyone with a contra-opinion is simply ‘assassinated’. Or perhaps that’s just a euphemism for “target shooting”? ;O)

      I’m all for learning… just not impressed by trolling.

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      1. Colin jenkins

        Fair enough – nothing wrong with understanding an issue before deciding what you want to do.

        With regard to the author (Gaz) I will vouch for his integrity, He has emailed me independently in the past and before using my Comments (made elsewhere) on his blog, so it’s a shame his email To you didn’t get through, as he is a bloody good journalist and an asset to shooters in the UK

        Anyway, safe shooting whatever your chosen discipline

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      2. Nick B

        It’s not blind backing of something you do not know / understand – it’s backing of other shooting sports – surely you’re aware of how unpopular the shooting sports are in this country?

        For eg I know very little of Wild Fowling but would willingly support anyone undertaking such a pastime with legally held firearms.

        The point is we’re all in it together when it comes to licensed firearms / shotguns – you don’t need to understand each and every possible form of shooting to understand the risks to our continued participation in same.

        Nick

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  9. Iain

    Nick,

    “surely you’re aware of how unpopular the shooting sports are in this country?” – to be honest, NO!

    Other than “hunt saboteurs” etc being on the news over the past 20-30 years (I do back ‘hunting’ simply from the point of view of Country Traditions etc!), I had no real knowledge of anything to do with shooting till a Sunday shotgun session on a mate’s land in Dec 2014. As part of the interview for SGC, I was advised to “keep it quiet” ref gun ownership etc, and not to advertise having them, but other than that, I have not been exposed to any anti-gun histrionics/hysteria at all. Just last week, I was shooting in Scotland, and no hassles at all – even leaving the guns with the hotel concierge was “no bother” as they’re used to it.

    Obviously, Michael Ryan, Dunblane, etc have always been on the radar, and the cause of much of the legislation, but as I had no interest in shooting at the time, I never read up on any of the specifics. If something affects/interests me, I will read up on the full detail, and often the law too. Alas, I don’t have enough time in the day to read up on everything else.

    I’m not saying I can’t or won’t support other shooting disciplines, merely that I would need to read up on them first, to understand them more fully, before backing them wholeheartedly. Till then, I choose not to voice an opinion either way, as it would be an uneducated opinion.

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  10. Giles

    Iain,

    But you did state an opinion about other shooting skills and it was clearly along the lines of my none shooting friends who see no reason for anyone to own guns as it doesn’t affect them.

    I would be happy to invite you to my clubs so you can try semi automatic, bench and prone shooting, along with black powder and lever action full bore firearms.

    But I wouldn’t wait too long. As if we do not unite in defence of our collective hobby it could be banned by the EU before we get a chance.

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